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eugene_MPC
08.09.13, 07:22 PM
hello,

may naencounter na po ba kayong pyesa ng gloria (papuri sa Diyos) na hanggang first stanza lang?

we used to sing a similar version way before and it was written in Kapampangan. some priests po kasi prefer it kasi hindi masyadong mahaba.

liturgically permitted/correct po ba ito?

does anyone has similar versions in other churches?

thank you. :)

titopao
08.09.13, 07:40 PM
Hi Eugene,

Pasintabi lang sa mga pari ninyo na pinayagan yung putol na Gloria, but it's NOT permitted. Kasi, the Gloria is part of the canon of the Holy Mass, it is one of the mandatory prayers/anthems na hindi pwedeng i-alter.

Maski na yung first part ng Gloria ay kinuha nyo word for word sa---in your case---official Kapampangan version ng Mass, hindi pa rin permitted na putol ang pagkanta nito. It would be just as worse as radically altering the words itself without permission from the authorities (and in this case, hindi pwedeng yung pari lang ang magdecide on his own).

Ang analogy ko would be: Imagine singing just the first three lines of the National Anthem in a formal function like a flag-raising ceremony. (Though in the case of the Lupang Hinirang, doing so will actually merit a fine or a short jail sentence :P )

Hope this helps :)

eugene_MPC
08.09.14, 02:08 PM
thank you po tito pau for your comment.

actually, back then when we're still singing the "putol" version, we felt that it's kinda incorrect to sing it. but back then kasi, when we were obligated to sing only kapampagan songs throughout the mass (since the mass we serve is in kapampangan), nahirapan kami maghanap ng 'gloria' na kapampangan, and the only music sheet we found was the "putol" version. and that time, it was used by other choirs and nearby parishes, so felt that it is ok to sing it.

after sometime, one of our members came up a new composition (hindi na putol) in the same language. so that solved the problem.

right now, it is not that strict so we are able to sing songs in tagalog and english as long as it is appropriate. of course, we always try to sing bukas palad songs whenever appropriate!

cardinal_jaf
08.09.14, 11:10 PM
Years ago, we had a related dilemma regarding one priest (a foreigner)in our church. iba naman yung style nya... during Gloria, instead of the Glory to God, he prefers to sing Dan Schutte's "Glory and Praise". There was one time when we started singing Glory to God, he stopped us (sabay ng hand gesture na parang traffic police) and began singing his favorite Glory and Praise. (:( napahiya tuloy kami). Buti na lang, he no longer officiates mass during our scheduled service. I dont know if he still does "his" style until now.

When our choir had a seminar on liturgical music, with a speaker-priest from the Archdiocese's Commission on Liturgy, we told him about the particular priest's style. Sabi nya, di talaga tama na palitan ng kahit anumang words yung mga responses, or i-short-cut man.

eugene_MPC
08.09.15, 05:57 AM
hello cardinal, thanks po sa comment.

i can truly relate with your experience. i've been in the choir for "17" years now, and i can say we (choir) had a lot of similar experiences such as yours.

since we are talking about singing the shortcut version of the gloria, let me tell you about one particular priest we had who requested that the gloria be sung only until the first stanza. maybe because, like i said before that the "putol"/short cut version had been widely used by other choirs and parishes, that is why he prefers it. at that time po kasi, we were using the "uncut"/full version na nacompose ng isang member namin, and he (priest) even suggested that on ordinary sundays, the short cut version will be used and the full version will be reserved on special occasions like christmas and easter. of course, wala kami nagawa kundi sundin sya.

after many months of singing, we finally decided not to sing the shortcut version and just let the gloria be recited instead.

one more thing that i forgot to tell you, the shortcut version we used to sing before were actually composed by a priest!

ernanibaetiong
08.09.15, 09:19 AM
after many months of singing, we finally decided not to sing the shortcut version and just let the gloria be recited instead.

Hi eugene_MPC, I think you did a very noble thing here.

Problem with some foreign priests (and even ordinary laymen) is that they do not appreciate or know how much we in the Philippines value music in the liturgy. Some stubborn Filipino priests do the same also, very sad and it puts the choir in a very bad spot if you ask me. Church musicians want to put their all in their service, making sure that pieces are rendered well, but people outside prevent us in many ways in doing so. So for this move of yours, I know how hard it is to let go of a song but I know that you made this step to preserve the integrity of the liturgy. Kudos to you!:)

eugene_MPC
08.09.15, 11:30 PM
thanks a lot ernanibaetiong for the comment.

i think it is important that we know more about our role/part on the liturgy para when problems arise, we know what to do.

naalala ko tuloy yung talk ni Father Manoling na, "Music in the Eucharist: Guidelines for Music Ministers" nung choir convention sa Ateneo. :)
very informative.

nmerencilla
08.09.25, 04:32 PM
Tama po silang lahat,
Ang GLORIA ay isa sa mga mandatory songs / prayer ng ating simbahan. maraming mga version OO pero hindi dapat putolin what so ever siguro kong gusto nila ng maiksi your group may sing yung pinaka maiksi na version ng Gloria pesensya nakalimutan ko kung sino yung composer nun sensya po talaga :)

Alexander
08.09.26, 05:38 AM
nmerencilla,

If you're referring to Misa Collection 1, its Fr Marcelo yata :)

eugene_MPC
08.09.29, 03:22 PM
hi reksuyah. i think mas maganda kung gumawa ka nalang ng isang new thread for this. pero ang administrator nalang po bahala.:):)

anyways, about the glory to god, i have to agree with you, meron ngang tenor part after the second stanza. and from what i know, wala pang updated musical score for this. :):)

reksuyah
08.10.02, 12:11 PM
hello,

may naencounter na po ba kayong pyesa ng gloria (papuri sa Diyos) na hanggang first stanza lang?

we used to sing a similar version way before and it was written in Kapampangan.


ito ba yung kapampangan version that goes "ligaya cing dios, ligaya cing dios, ligaya cing dios atas abanwa....?" (tama ba yung pagkakare-call ko ng lyrics?)

kasi we had regional masses dito sa parish. we were assigned to sing in the kapampangan mass (pati nga dun sa bicolano) pero wala naman isa sa min ang kapampangan. nagpahanap kami ng pyesa sa mga kakilala tapos ito nga yung binigay na papuri. when we were practicing, i noticed that it was not complete. tinanong ko baka may mga missing pages, eh wala naman daw. yung lang daw yun. sabi ko, ala eh kulang yung words ng gloria... anyway we sang it, the priest from pampanga did not react or anything... he knew the song. i was waiting na tumingin siya sa amin eh in case kulang yung nakanta namin. eh hindi naman. he continued with the prayer... pero mali nga yung puputulin natin yung gloria.

but i enjoyed the kapampangan songs... masaya sya... medyo nakakatawa for us who dont speak kapampngan kasi sa pronounciation namin parang awkward. pag naulit yung regional masses, i know now who to pm hahaha.

eugene_MPC
08.10.02, 04:16 PM
hi reksuyah,

tama ka. this is one of the version we used before. medyo may konting mali lang sa lyrics. bale ganito sya: ligaya king Dios, ligaya king Dios, ligaya king Dios king matas a banua... :):)
actually, meron pang isang version, pero ito yung popular.
it is interesting to know na ang parish nyo is holding regional masses, it is something i never heard/experience before. i must have been a challenge for you (choir) to sing in a dialect you don't speak.:):)

reksuyah
08.10.02, 11:31 PM
hi eugene,

maganda yung papuri na yon. yung nga lang kulang. why not add the missing verses (mag suggest ba.. haha) kung ito yung popular? kasi madaling sundan ng tao yung tono nun.

off topic: oo nagkaroon kami ng regional masses, ilocano, kapampangan, cabuano, waray, bicol, hiligaynon etc.... at siyempre pati kanta dapat yung dialect din, naku pahirapan sa paghanap ng piyesa. our choir sang sa kapampangan at bikolano. tumulong din ako sa cebuano songs since may alam din akong konti dun . sana nga maulit. kasi this year sectoral masses naman (civil servants, med profession, educators, vendors, trike drivers ganun)

favorite ko yung offertory namin nun... king gamat mi darala mi...kengkeng sarili haha tama ba? parang lullaby ang tune. communion maganda din ... atiu kung siping mo or sumthing like that... kekakatakut...kekakarug... parang ganun eh. masaya din ung recessional. mayaman ang kapampangan sa liturgical songs ha. galing!

Ana Maria Licup
08.10.03, 08:05 AM
Tama po silang lahat,
Ang GLORIA ay isa sa mga mandatory songs / prayer ng ating simbahan. maraming mga version OO pero hindi dapat putolin :)

Hindi talaga dapat putulin ang Gloria or substitute it with something else whether it is recited or sung. The priest can not change any part of the liturgy.

eugene_MPC
08.10.03, 11:55 AM
hi reksuyah,

it's nice to know na meron nakakaappreciate ng kapampangan liturgical songs.:):)

about the papuri, hindi kasi kami ang nagcompose nun eh if ever mag aadd kami ng verse; and at the time we were using it, we felt 'confident' na ok lang syang kantahin kasi nga pari ang nagcompose nung version na yon. until such time that one of our member composed a full version, not because alam namin na mali kantahin yung short version at that time but maybe because nakakasawa na kantahin yung short version .

yung offertory na "king gamit mi" kikakanta pa rin namin yon, very popular yung song na yon. though kapampangan yung mass namin konti lang kinakanta namin kapampangan songs kasi konti lang yung choices sa mga songs.and because na rin malakas ang "influence" ng jesuit music sa amin. hehe:):) pero pagspecial occasions, we make it a point to come up with an entire kapampangan repertoire. one particular celebration is the holy week, meron kaming repertiore from palm sunday up to the triduum mass puro kapampangan songs from entrance to communion. doon talaga naaapreciate namin mga kapampangan songs.

sorry po kung off topic na.:):)

casper89
09.06.03, 11:04 AM
Kuya Eugene_MPC... kapampangan ku din pu pwedepasend kaku tang piece na ning GLORIANG KAPAMPANGAN. DakaL pung SaLamat..

Or masKi nanu Pung kapampangasn LiturGicaL songs... Buri kuLa pu kasing ibaLik deng kantang kaPampangan keni Bamban, nya Lang aLa ku Kopya.. DakaL pu saLamat

eugene_MPC
09.06.04, 09:41 AM
hi casper,

ano ba gusto mo version ng gloria? yung "short" or "full" version? hehe. well, i guess you we're referring to the "full" version kasi nga hindi na appriopriate yung isa. cge, sabihin ko muna sa kasama namin, sya kasi nagcompose nun eh. detang aliwang kapampangan songs, atin ku mga few songs keni, though medyu luma nala, cguro ibie munamu ing email add mu para karin kula i send detang songs.:):)

recoletomusic
09.10.28, 11:43 PM
What composers and music ministers should remember is the fact na pinaghirapan ng Church authorities ang pagbuo sa ating Roman Missal. Hindi naman siguro makatarungan na palitan o putulin na lamang ng basta ang mga responses and songs like the Gloria.

markjeff
09.10.29, 02:44 PM
yung sa triduum mass ni ryan c full text ata yung pero maikli lang.

anf kingbemie
10.06.21, 02:40 PM
kakabasa ko lang po ng buong threard
at nagulat talaga ko meron palang gloria n single stanza lang at pinayagan pa, hindi ba masagwa naman pakinggan un kasi ang gloria ay isa sa mga pinakamahalagang part ng mga holy mass,
sakin nga gustong gusto namin ung original version ng Luwalhati sa diyos ni Fr. Hontiveros(LSD Album) dahil pagpupuri yun at pagluluwalhati, erh di pagpinutol ibig sabihn pinutol mo rin ang pagpupuri diba?

jackiefrances
10.07.29, 10:52 AM
hi po! new member here..pwede po bang makisali sa request ni casper kay kuya Eugene? would like to ask po sana for copies of kapampangan liturgical songs.. thanks po!:)