Liturgical Song Discussion Section dedicated to the discussion of the proper use of what we consider as "liturgical songs"
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titopao
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Re: Ama Namin (Jazz Version), Posted 09.02.19 #11
Dun nga din ako nagkakaproblema (among other things). What is wrong with the tritone chords? Can anyone give me a more convincing reason other than because it was historically called "the devil in music"?

Kaya lang naman yan tinawag na "the devil in music" kasi noong mga panahong binigay yung bansag na 'yon (pre-Renaissance), harmony in music was overly simple. Ni yung mga seventh and ninth chords wala rin noong time na 'yun, it was just as simple as the basic triadic chords. Ni mga modulations nga na alam natin ngayon hindi rin naimbento/nadiskubre noon. The name "the devil in music" is a historical artifact that, unfortunately, some misguided people take too seriously and akala nila forever nang ganon. That is what you get when people don't know history well.

These days, nawala na yung "demonic" "taint" ng tritone as the harmonic vocabulary of music has expanded tremendously. Tritones are now part of our everyday music experience, whether you're aware of it or not. It even appears in the corpus of musica sacra, so this only means that other composers have known better and have got over any reservationss about using tritones. As for me, ginagamit ko sya every now and then pag tumutugtog ako sa church (although hindi naman kada chord, magiging tunog-bitin yung music pag panay tritone ang gamit ko )

For Fr. Nilo to simplify things without even fully studying and understanding them only exhibit his gross misunderstanding of music history. And akala ko pa naman, per the pics on his Facebook profile, nag-aral sya sa isang conservatory of music...hindi ba tinuro ang lahat ng ito sa kanyang Music History classes noon?
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Bien
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Re: Ama Namin (Jazz Version), Posted 09.02.19 #12
Quote:
Originally Posted by NikNoK View Post
Uhm... teka parang ito yung isa sa mga kontrobersyal na Ama Namin ah... ito ba yung may "tritone" na tunog? yung medyo disturbing daw ang chords pag pinakinggan?

Popular nga siya.. especially before ito yung paboritong kantahin eh.. jazz kasi... pero liturgically speaking, i agree na hindi siya fit kantahin sa misa.

Nik,

Musta?
I have posted iyong mp3 and arrangement ko nung kontrobersyal na Ama Naman with dusturbing chords? Sabi ko sa post ko, for personal use only hehe although nung college days sikat nga itong version na ito.
Pls check.

Tama din si kuya Alex, depende sa arrangements na lang siguro.

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Bien
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Re: Ama Namin (Jazz Version), Posted 09.02.19 #13
From EWTN. Please click on the link to read more...

Quote:
Sacred Music: Style
Music may exist in an authentic style and be well-performed and stylistically correct, but not be acceptable for the liturgy. A well-trained brass band playing the marches of Sousa demonstrates a fine example of military style music. A well-rehearsed combo can show what contemporary folk or western music should be, an example of those styles. A great symphony orchestra, playing the best of the orchestral literature, can be in first place in performance of classical or romantic or contemporary styles. But the judgement about such efforts for church use must cause us to reject them all, since they do not fulfill the requirement of sacredness. They may be art; they certainly show a good performance practice.

On the other hand, some music, while taken to be sacred because of the sacred texts or because the melody is known as a sacred song, fails because of the lack of true art, either in the composing of the piece or in the manner of performance. Regardless of the century, the vocal or instrumental requirements, or the good intentions of the composer and the performers, it is unacceptable since it lacks a goodness of form. It is not art.
Is there an "Ama Namin" music composed and arranged by Fr. Nilo? If there is, please upload. I am very interested to hear his music style.
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Re: Ama Namin (Jazz Version), Posted 09.02.19 #14
Hi, Bien!

Ok ok naman ako, thanks bro.... buti ka pa nakakapag-arrange ka na ng mga songs.. sana matuto rin ako niyan balang araw.


Back to the topic... yeah, very controversial talaga yung Ama Namin.... I must admit.. it used to be one of my Favorite versions. Nung college din ako.. yan ang paboritong paboritong tugtugin ng gitarista namin sa school.. Maski sa ibang mga simbahan, yan din ang madalas tugtugin... iba kasi talaga yung jazz effect and nakakapukaw ng attention. I remember seeing parishioners swaying their bodies while singing this version during the Mass.

Teka, nasagot na ba yung tanong ni kuyakoe2 kung sino composer nitong Ama Namin na Jazz version? Has anyone seen the scoresheet?
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Alexander
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Re: Ama Namin (Jazz Version), Posted 09.02.20 #15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuyakoe2 View Post
Ask ko lang po if mayron kayong information kung sino po ang composer ng version na ito ng Ama Namin. Maganda po kasi ang tono nito... Salamat po!
Eto yung tanong.... ako rin di ko rin alam kung sino e.... bakit kaya napaka misteryoso ng composition na iyan...

@nik... ako rin College pa ako nung una kong narinig yan sa Campus Ministry namin at lagi rin naming kinakanta sa mass... mga 1986(?) yata.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NikNoK View Post
Hi, Bien!

Teka, nasagot na ba yung tanong ni kuyakoe2 kung sino composer nitong Ama Namin na Jazz version? Has anyone seen the scoresheet?
Meron ako... kaso mga personal transcriptions lang at hindi yung original... ni walang composer's name e.... nakalagay lang "UST"
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Bien
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Re: Ama Namin (Jazz Version), Posted 09.02.20 #16
Sa campus ministry (Adamson U) ko din yan unang narinig eh.
Everyday kasi may misa sa campus chapel, kala ko nga iyong nag compose nyan ay iyong campus minister namin na musician. Pero hindi ko naman naitanong talaga kung sino gumawa ng song.

Pero malamang pinoy nag compose nyan, hehe...si anonimus dela cruz
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Re: Ama Namin (Jazz Version), Posted 09.02.20 #17
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Originally Posted by Bien View Post
Nik,

Musta?
I have posted iyong mp3 and arrangement ko nung kontrobersyal na Ama Naman...
Regards,
Bien
Hello Kuya Bien, where did you posted the mp3 of that "controversial" Ama Namin. I wanna hear it. Thanks.
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Re: Ama Namin (Jazz Version), Posted 09.02.20 #18
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Originally Posted by Alna_lou View Post
Hello Kuya Bien, where did you posted the mp3 of that "controversial" Ama Namin. I wanna hear it. Thanks.
Hi Alna,

Nasa midi request (music section din)...in mp3 format sya.

Bien
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Re: Ama Namin (Jazz Version), Posted 09.02.20 #19
Got it. Thanks po Kuya
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Re: Ama Namin (Jazz Version), Posted 09.02.20 #20
So malamang magandang reference ang mga taga-UST say yung campus ministry office nila para mag-inquire kung kilala nila ang composer ng Ama Namin Jazz version na ito? Hindi kaya isang seminarista o pari yung nag-compose nito? at meron din kaya siyang ibang na-arrange na songs other than this one?

Eventhough i think na hindi lang fit for liturgical yung Ama Namin na na-compose niya, i believe He is a very good composer / musician. I'm very curious of the other arrangements that He made.
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